HomeCounter-Racism Radio NetworkCounter-Racism Television NetworkArticlesProjectsCounter-Racism Work/Study ProjectShopping MallContact
Secure DonationsSecure Donations  FAQFAQ  SearchSearch  MemberlistMemberlist  RegisterRegister  ProfileProfile  Log inLog in

Don't Get Ahead Of Yourself

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Counter-Racism Work/Study Project Forum Index -> Using Words Correctly
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Edward Williams
Site Admin


Joined: 12 Apr 2003
Posts: 3079
Location: I am from everywhere I've ever been and everywhere I've never been

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2004 7:20 am    Post subject: Don't Get Ahead Of Yourself Reply with quote

I have heard non-white people state that the Cress Theory of Color Confrontation is an "upgrade" to the United-Independent Compensatory Code/System/Concept.

I would like to state for the record that there is no evidence that either the Cress Theory of Color Confrontation nor the United-Independent Compensatory Code/System/Concept has done anything to replace white supremacy (racism) with justice, since white supremacy (racism) still exists.

Therefore it is best to say:

United-Independent Compensatory Code/System/Concept + Cress Theory of Color Confrontation = ZERO.

Until such time as the SYSTEM of white supremacy (racism) is replaced with a SYSTEM of justice, both the Cress Theory of Color Confrontation and the United-Independent Compensatory Code/System/Concept are only concepts and neither can be measured as an "upgrade" of the other because neither can be measured on its own in relation to having done anything.

Once the SYSTEM of white supremacy (racism) is replaced with a SYSTEM of justice the measurement for its replacement can take place.

Don't get ahead of yourself.
_________________
What is the reason YOU were born into a SYSTEM of INJUSTICE if not to replace it with a SYSTEM of JUSTICE?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Josh



Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Posts: 796
Location: Closer

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2004 11:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
both the Cress Theory of Color Confrontation and the United-Independent Compensatory Code/System/Concept are only concepts and neither can be measured as an "upgrade" of the other because neither can be measured on its own in relation to having done anything.


Yeah, thats true.

But I still find much value in them as concepts because even people who have no concept of Justice have concepts of other types of existence/functioning.

The concept often contains the logic for how and why to do something.

From as far back as I can remember I was taught about "heaven" by people who ain't never been there or experienced it...

They gave me the concept of "heaven".

Armed with the concept, they didn't hafta twist my arm to convince me I would want to go there when I die.

Josh
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Edward Williams
Site Admin


Joined: 12 Apr 2003
Posts: 3079
Location: I am from everywhere I've ever been and everywhere I've never been

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2004 6:58 am    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

Josh wrote:
Quote:
both the Cress Theory of Color Confrontation and the United-Independent Compensatory Code/System/Concept are only concepts and neither can be measured as an "upgrade" of the other because neither can be measured on its own in relation to having done anything.


Yeah, thats true.

But I still find much value in them as concepts because even people who have no concept of Justice have concepts of other types of existence/functioning.

The concept often contains the logic for how and why to do something.

From as far back as I can remember I was taught about "heaven" by people who ain't never been there or experienced it...

They gave me the concept of "heaven".

Armed with the concept, they didn't hafta twist my arm to convince me I would want to go there when I die.

Josh

That may be true. People find value in lots of things. Finding value in a thing is nothing new. People should find value in all speech and/or action that minimizes conflict between people while maximizing constructive interaction...but don't get ahead of yourself and think you have something in your hand...and then the racists (white supremacists) show up practicing direct violence and you end up fooling yourself.
_________________
What is the reason YOU were born into a SYSTEM of INJUSTICE if not to replace it with a SYSTEM of JUSTICE?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Josh



Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Posts: 796
Location: Closer

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2004 10:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That may be true. People find value in lots of things. Finding value in a thing is nothing new.


But what is the logic behind people finding value in something they have never experienced or seen experienced?

For White people and non white people, racism White supremacy is not a concept.

White people don't have to "guess" or "hope" racism White supremacy has value to them.

Its tangible, they can see it, they can PRACTICE IT.

But Every Sunday millions of Black people get dressed up and go to church to learn how to "get to heaven". They are learning from a person who has never been there.

How does a concept have that kind of effect on behavior?

Josh
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Edward Williams
Site Admin


Joined: 12 Apr 2003
Posts: 3079
Location: I am from everywhere I've ever been and everywhere I've never been

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2004 12:21 pm    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

Josh wrote:
That may be true. People find value in lots of things. Finding value in a thing is nothing new.


But what is the logic behind people finding value in something they have never experienced or seen experienced?

For White people and non white people, racism White supremacy is not a concept.

White people don't have to "guess" or "hope" racism White supremacy has value to them.

Its tangible, they can see it, they can PRACTICE IT.

But Every Sunday millions of Black people get dressed up and go to church to learn how to "get to heaven". They are learning from a person who has never been there.

How does a concept have that kind of effect on behavior?

Josh

I suspect going to heaven is about "belief". "Belief" in something without knowledge of truth about that something will always affect a person's behavior adversely. This is where the conversation takes a turn for the worse because we were discussing the difference between concept and reality and not thinking that a concept is a reality and attempting to measure it as such. But I'll bite...

Things that may or may not exist have always had an effect on people's behavior. This is nothing new. Heaven , "the boogie man", etc., are concepts that may or may not exist.

The question is...whether it is best to believe you have something that you do not have. The Cress Theory of Color Confrontation and the United-Independent Compensatory Code/System/Concept are both concepts that have not proven that a SYSTEM of justice is even attainable...because it ain't here yet. The suggestion in terms of Using Words Correctly is don't start measuring something that ain't here yet by stating one concept is an "upgrade" of the other.
_________________
What is the reason YOU were born into a SYSTEM of INJUSTICE if not to replace it with a SYSTEM of JUSTICE?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Dan Freeman



Joined: 12 Apr 2003
Posts: 650
Location: Wherever I'm sent.

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2004 12:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Virtual_God wrote:
Quote:
I suspect going to heaven is about "belief". "Belief" in something without knowledge of truth about that something will always affect a person's behavior adversely.


1. Do you belive in JUSTICE?

2. Have you expiereinced JUSTICE?

smallz
_________________
Understanding is honoring the truth beneath the surface.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Edward Williams
Site Admin


Joined: 12 Apr 2003
Posts: 3079
Location: I am from everywhere I've ever been and everywhere I've never been

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2004 12:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

smallz wrote:
Virtual_God wrote:
Quote:
I suspect going to heaven is about "belief". "Belief" in something without knowledge of truth about that something will always affect a person's behavior adversely.


1. Do you belive in JUSTICE?

2. Have you expiereinced JUSTICE?

smallz

Answer:

(1) Nope.
(2) Nope.

I suspect justice is attainable based on the definition of justice I use. I don't "beLIEve" in it and I have not experienced it. If my definition of justice was "to be able to shake the hand of all white people" I suspect that is not attainable since I have no mechanism for determining, without error, which person is a white person.
_________________
What is the reason YOU were born into a SYSTEM of INJUSTICE if not to replace it with a SYSTEM of JUSTICE?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Dan Freeman



Joined: 12 Apr 2003
Posts: 650
Location: Wherever I'm sent.

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2004 12:51 pm    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

Virtual_GOD wrote:
smallz wrote:
Virtual_God wrote:
Quote:
I suspect going to heaven is about "belief". "Belief" in something without knowledge of truth about that something will always affect a person's behavior adversely.


1. Do you belive in JUSTICE?

2. Have you expiereinced JUSTICE?

smallz

Answer:

(1) Nope.
(2) Nope.

I suspect justice is attainable based on the definition of justice I use. I don't "beLIEve" in it and I have not experienced it. If my definition of justice was "to be able to shake the hand of all white people" I suspect that is not attainable since I have no mechanism for determining, without error, which person is a white person.


I take a different position.

I choose to belive in JUSTICE, as I've defined it, although I have not expierienced it. I've chosen to do this because I have committed to trying to establish JUSTICE since I've also concluded that its is better than Racism.

But since I've never expierience JUSTICE, my premise could be incorrect.

smallz
_________________
Understanding is honoring the truth beneath the surface.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Edward Williams
Site Admin


Joined: 12 Apr 2003
Posts: 3079
Location: I am from everywhere I've ever been and everywhere I've never been

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2004 1:15 pm    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

smallz wrote:
Virtual_GOD wrote:
smallz wrote:
Virtual_God wrote:
Quote:
I suspect going to heaven is about "belief". "Belief" in something without knowledge of truth about that something will always affect a person's behavior adversely.


1. Do you belive in JUSTICE?

2. Have you expiereinced JUSTICE?

smallz

Answer:

(1) Nope.
(2) Nope.

I suspect justice is attainable based on the definition of justice I use. I don't "beLIEve" in it and I have not experienced it. If my definition of justice was "to be able to shake the hand of all white people" I suspect that is not attainable since I have no mechanism for determining, without error, which person is a white person.


I take a different position.

I choose to belive in JUSTICE, as I've defined it, although I have not experienced it. I've chosen to do this because I have committed to trying to establish JUSTICE since I've also concluded that its is better than Racism.

But since I've never experience JUSTICE, my premise could be incorrect.

smallz

Since religion is "belief backed up by action" does that make justice your religion?

The approach I take allows me to take a more scientific approach to examining how to replace white supremacy (racism) with justice. I tried the "belief" approach but I kept getting ahead of myself. I would tend to "beLIEve" things, sometimes even things people said, and associate them with my belief of justice. It took away from the scientific approach of carefully examining everything and finding out how all the components work...because "beLIEf" in something doesn't require a person to carefully examine anything to find out how all of the components work.

I could be incorrect.
_________________
What is the reason YOU were born into a SYSTEM of INJUSTICE if not to replace it with a SYSTEM of JUSTICE?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Karim



Joined: 08 Sep 2003
Posts: 329
Location: Orion's Belt

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2004 3:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Don't Get Ahead Of Yourself Reply with quote

Virtual_GOD wrote:
I have heard non-white people state that the Cress Theory of Color Confrontation is an "upgrade" to the United-Independent Compensatory Code/System/Concept.

I would like to state for the record that there is no evidence that either the Cress Theory of Color Confrontation nor the United-Independent Compensatory Code/System/Concept has done anything to replace white supremacy (racism) with justice, since white supremacy (racism) still exists.

Therefore it is best to say:

United-Independent Compensatory Code/System/Concept + Cress Theory of Color Confrontation = ZERO.

Until such time as the SYSTEM of white supremacy (racism) is replaced with a SYSTEM of justice, both the Cress Theory of Color Confrontation and the United-Independent Compensatory Code/System/Concept are only concepts and neither can be measured as an "upgrade" of the other because neither can be measured on its own in relation to having done anything.

Once the SYSTEM of white supremacy (racism) is replaced with a SYSTEM of justice the measurement for its replacement can take place.

Don't get ahead of yourself.
Yes excellent post...
_________________
Replace White Supremacy (racism) with Ma'at
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Josh



Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Posts: 796
Location: Closer

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2004 4:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I need to review this thread for a while (incorporating all the correct compensatory definitions) in order to figure out what questions to ask.

Quote:
This is where the conversation takes a turn for the worse because we were discussing the difference between concept and reality and not thinking that a concept is a reality and attempting to measure it as such. But I'll bite...


Sorry man, but Im one of the "slow brothas".

I thought concept and reality were opposites.

for me, when it comes to "doing the math", racism is a reality and Justice is a concept, like "heaven"...

I have enough evidence that racism White supremacy is incorrect and should be replaced.

The concept of Justice is gonna hafta do until I can make it a reality.



Josh
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Dan Freeman



Joined: 12 Apr 2003
Posts: 650
Location: Wherever I'm sent.

PostPosted: Sat Oct 30, 2004 3:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

V_God wrote:
Quote:
Since religion is "belief backed up by action" does that make justice your religion?


Yes.

smallz
_________________
Understanding is honoring the truth beneath the surface.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Edward Williams
Site Admin


Joined: 12 Apr 2003
Posts: 3079
Location: I am from everywhere I've ever been and everywhere I've never been

PostPosted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 9:55 am    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

Winston Wolfe wrote:
V_God wrote:
Quote:
Since religion is "belief backed up by action" does that make justice your religion?


Yes.

smallz

Do you practice your religion?
_________________
What is the reason YOU were born into a SYSTEM of INJUSTICE if not to replace it with a SYSTEM of JUSTICE?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Dan Freeman



Joined: 12 Apr 2003
Posts: 650
Location: Wherever I'm sent.

PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2005 7:57 pm    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

Edward Williams wrote:
Winston Wolfe wrote:
V_God wrote:
Quote:
Since religion is "belief backed up by action" does that make justice your religion?


Yes.

smallz

Do you practice your religion?


Not in a system of In-Justice.

However, I try to promote it as much as possible.
_________________
Understanding is honoring the truth beneath the surface.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Edward Williams
Site Admin


Joined: 12 Apr 2003
Posts: 3079
Location: I am from everywhere I've ever been and everywhere I've never been

PostPosted: Mon May 23, 2005 10:09 am    Post subject: Re: Reply with quote

Winston Wolfe wrote:
Edward Williams wrote:
Winston Wolfe wrote:
V_God wrote:
Quote:
Since religion is "belief backed up by action" does that make justice your religion?


Yes.

smallz

Do you practice your religion?


Not in a system of In-Justice.

However, I try to promote it as much as possible.

How can religion be "a strong belief backup up by action", justice be your religion...but you not practice justice?
_________________
What is the reason YOU were born into a SYSTEM of INJUSTICE if not to replace it with a SYSTEM of JUSTICE?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Counter-Racism Work/Study Project Forum Index -> Using Words Correctly All times are GMT - 4 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group
Web CalendarShopping MallDonations